Morning all.
Before this World Cup, I didn’t know who Pau Cubarsi was but I do now. His story is incredible really. He’s just 19 years old yet has already featured in 128 matches for Barcelona and 20 for Spain. (Assuming Wiki is correct) At 16 years old, one day before his 17th birthday, he was in Barcelona’s first team, a starter against Real Betis. He just missed out on the Euros 2024, instead he helped the under 21’s with an Olympic Gold medal. Yesterday, he became a World Cup winner, picking up the young player of the tournament at the same time. Incredible really.
Barcelona don’t seem to fear giving young players their chance and once they are in, they are in to stay if they do really well. Lamine Yamal is another example of that. Yet in England, certainly at Arsenal, age seems to matter.
William Saliba had to go out on loan before he was finally given an opportunity at Arsenal, both Ethan Nwaneri and Myles Lewis-Skelly have been in and out of the side despite showing great promise and right now we have Max Dowman and Marli Salmon who let’s be honest, have not really put a foot wrong. Both turn 17 years old later this year, Salmon in August, Dowman in December, the same age Cubarsi was when he made his La Liga bow.
I wonder, is it simply a case of the Premier League being more physical than La Liga which prevents Mikel Arteta taking the risk on playing our younger players more than he does or are these players really not as good as I perhaps think they are?
This isn’t me having a pop at our manager but one has to wonder why it took so long for him to play Lewis-Skelly in midfield last season when we all knew it was always likely his best position? Let’s be honest, as Arsenal chased down the Premier League title in those final few weeks of the campaign, he was very good.
I think footballers, sports players in general really, raise their game when playing with better players, especially when they are young and fearless. As much as I know we need to sign players this summer because we cannot afford to stand still, especially as other clubs are strengthening their own position but I hope we don’t leave top talented players behind as we go. No doubt that might be a good enough reason to sign someone like John Stones, if the rumour is true of course, because not only do we have Cristhian Mosquera in our squad but Salmon too who in my opinion, so far looks far to promising to have his future blocked by signing another 25/26 year old defender. Obviously I have no idea what’s going on with the fitness of William Saliba and Jurrien Timber, nor Ben White but sometimes, if a young player shows he’s got what it takes and he’s physically strong, believe in him.
I’m looking forward to our pre-season games because I think they will give us more of a clue as to who might be in Arteta’s plans for the coming season. As much as a clue as anything Arteta says or does ever gives us.
Lastly, congratulations to Arsenal’s Spanish trio of Mikel Merino, Martin Zubimendi and David Raya who were part of the World Cup winning Spain squad. For Arsenal reasons though, I’m glad all three didn’t feature much, or at all in Raya’s case. I bet Merino is still wondering how he missed his chance to head home a goal for his country. lol
Catch up later.
Very true, Potter, I think generally the bigger clubs played a slightly better version because they had better players, and Bill Shankly knew how to build a winning team. (I always used to wonder how Shankly and Denis Law got on, because Shankly managed Law at Huddersfield, Shankly went to Liverpool and Law ended up at United after a year in Italy). I know he bought Ian St John, but he would have been well aware of Denis Law’s potential.
As you say, very sad news about Kevin Keegan, I used to read his and Alan Ball’s column in ‘Shoot’ every week.
The lack of top English/British managers tells its own story Dennis.
I’d love to see a first team top heavy with academy players but with so much pressure to win, or for some clubs, survive in the PL, few will make it I guess unless they are top draw.
Make players or buy them, it’s the same in the PL. I hope we are soon able to move away from the always buying them. Just as I hope we see more of Dowman and Salmon this season.
“”Across our leagues for decades we played the long ball up to the big striker to knock it down for the little poacher, which doesn’t require a lot of technical ability.””
Taking into account today’s sad news that was the perfect description of Toshack and Keegan.which served Liverpool for quite a few years
Hopefully the English game is going to develop as the teams that become successful learn from their foreign peers and the international team generates a group ethic when they are on England duty .
For too many years our group has split on club lines , Lampard and Gerrard being classic examples of managers trying to shoehorn players into positions and jealousy between them.
La Masia is primarily the Hale End of Barcelona and the influence on Spain’s national team cannot be denied , Barcelona make their players whereas Real Madrid buy them in . Is this the pattern that has become part of Arteta’s process so will the Saka , MLS , Nwaneri become the backbone of England under the stewardship of Rice , is this why we wanted Rogers ?
Yes, maybe Rico.
Across our leagues for decades we played the long ball up to the big striker to knock it down for the little poacher, which doesn’t require a lot of technical ability. Or some used a tricky winger to supply crosses for the same end result.
I think it’s the reason we used to get so many shocks in the FA cup back in the day, because route-one can be a great equaliser for the smaller clubs.
The England style has been described as scrappy and untidy, so perhaps we need to look at English coaches and coaching and asking why none of them are at the top of the game.
Don Howe was our last English manager, and there isn’t one right now capable of taking the Arsenal job. Liverpool’s was Roy Evans, Chelsea’s (Lampard, Rosenior) both failed, City’s was Stuart Pearce (say no more). Of the current crop, Eddie Howe won a League cup with Newcastle, but struggled last year and is losing his best players. United are gambling with Carrick, and no English manager has won the PL.
Perhaps it’s because our clubs don’t have the same relationship with the FA as La Masia clearly has with the Spanish football hierarchy.
Even after Hungary (the origins and inspiration for the Dutch and Cruyff’s ‘Total Football’), gave us two football lessons in the early 1950’s (in Budapest and Wembley), we, as in England, didn’t change.
Maybe we should just accept that Alf Ramsey struck lucky in 1966, and that was the ‘golden generation’.
I hope they do, they deserve it!
Praying we don’t sigh Álvarez..
https://x.com/Arsenal/status/2079201218983760225
Ben White is fit, Jurrien Timber not far off it seems. The boys are back.
E.Martinez , Romero , L.Martinez , Fernandez ,Mac Alister , Senesi , and hopefully not Alvarez should all get a hell of a slagging throughout this coming and future seasons
I reckon Lewis-Skelly could Limey, he’s a strong looking lad. The two Spanish teenagers are quite slight.
RIP Kevin Keegan…
Afternoon all,
Interesting about young players,physicality is a big reason,I mean history tells you very few really break through and play week in week out. Wayne Rooney was one,he had the physique of someone much older,the fact Saka did it too,having a much smaller build shows how exceptional he is.
I’m pleased Spain won last night,it was a lousy game and I thought Argentina might hang on and win on penalties.
I’m not a fan of all the razzmataz,the World Cup doesn’t need that. They even had some muppets,and not just Infantino and Trump.
Dennis, perhaps like Arsenal academy players, English players aren’t as good as we think they are. There are always exceptions of course but I do wonder if the way football has gone, the technical side of the game in English players just isn’t there or isn’t taught from a very early age.
Totally agree re the Argies and that we play too many games. The latter though could be partly remedied by not playing “first team” players in either of the domestic cups, instead using the squad depth and more under 21’s.
Hi all.
Spain are definitely in the ascendancy.
European and World champions, a Spanish manager won the CL, Europa Lge and PL.
Liverpool and Chelsea have just appointed Spanish managers too.
It’s strange to me, that for a nation fixated on football, we haven’t built something similar to the La Masia academy in England.
Sure we built St.George’s Park (with the 2022 WC targeted as the one to win!), but it obviously doesn’t do enough to provide a platform for winning.
Lionel Messi literally moved to Barcelona at 13 with a family member, from Argentina, where they were responsible for his upbringing and personal development, which is miles ahead of anything English academies are doing.
Spain haven’t achieved this over-night, it took years to translate the style of winning football from the academy to the national side, but seven or eight of Spain’s starting XI came through La Masia’s academy.
England’s failings aren’t because of Tuchel, it is something deeper in our mind-set, and brand of football. And history tells us we are quite introverted, not great at taking lessons from ‘foreigners’.
I think we play too much football. We have breaks (Internationals, FA cup weekends etc.) but we also cram in a packed schedule often with three games in 8 days.
I think it’s also fair to say the Spanish and French players do not play in leagues anywhere near as physically and mentally draining, or as competitive as most of the English players.
I’m glad those thugs from Argentina got beat, such unprofessional and ungracious losers.
I will not miss the endless glorifying of Messi.
I’m just suggesting they are dealt with properly Kev but that comes down to having a better and more honest/unbiased group of officials. Ultimately, it’s Argentina who need to change and until they do, hit them with punishments.
Rico I get that, so if they don’t change just let them get away with it? 🤷♂️
I’m not bothered if they change or not I just want to see equal treatment met out by the officials and none of this softly softly approach in case the Argies start crying
Cicero, but at least there would be consequences and from I see sporting authorities just shy away from the difficult decisions when it comes to Argentina.
I mean if England or France or Ireland surrounded the referee as Argentina did the IRB would have come down line a ton of bricks…
And so, what has happened to Argentina and their threatening behaviour to the Australian referee… Silence mate, as usual, so next time the Argies might put their hands on the referee and so on. 🤷♂️
Afternoon Kev by the way.
The game needs better officials all round imo Kev but I don’t think Argentina will change their ways regardless of who the officials are or what cards they are dished out. They are just thugs in a football kit imo.
Sorry Kev, but I can’t agree re stronger refs and Argentina. It’s not just football, the same behaviour and disrespect was evident in the rugby match on Saturday. It seems to be a national trait.
Afternoon Rico, I just think that teams like Argentina are given a lot more leeway than say England because of their volatile and over emotional nature and thaf should not be the case. I’m not saying book someone early for a shove but if a player commits a bad challenge in the 1st minute then he should get a yellow card. Didn’t Rice get booked really early in one game? He still managed to get through the entire game.
The Argentinians are like children and are allowed to get away with stuff nobody else gets away with. Like children they will obviously push the boundaries if they sense weakness and tgen they cry when they’re sent to bed without any supper.
If we could only be more clinical in front of goal, it would be much easier to bring younger players through but we’re not. We drop a lot of points because we wasteful in front of goal imo.
I think a few players who Tuchel left at home would have served England better Kev. Not giving Mainoo minutes was bizarre, not playing Saka more was crazy. Not that I’m not glad of course.
I think it was Arsene Wenger who said that you have to be prepared to accept that young players will make mistakes and can and probably will cost you points so those are the risks with using young players.
Some of Barcelona’s matches in La Liga are like Arsenal playing a League One team in the FACup, there are no easy games in England as dropped points to the likes of Wolves last season signified.
I can see your point Kev but it’s football, Argentina players should know how to be in the game. If we go down the route of penalising their first shove in the back of opponents, that will have to be applied across the game in general imo. Not every player is as ghastly or aggressive as Argentina though.
I am not even sure that had McCalister been booked for his first nasty challenge, Argentina would have changed their approach. A strong referee would have sent 3/4 players off last night and the fifa will have been up in arms.
Would Lewis Skelly had been a better choice than Kobie Mainoo who it seemed upset the England manager and was sidelined? I think so, it’s such a shame that Arteta didn’t use him earlier than he did in midfield but in the end he used him in the Champions League final.
Now was that because Arteta didn’t trust Myles or was it that it took Myles awhile to grasp what was required in centre-midfield? You decide…
I also think that a fit Ben White would have been selected, I think he’s better than Konsa and would have linked up perfecting Bakayo and Noni
Morning Geoff, thanks. I think when it comes to younger players, we can perhaps to quick to judge. When a new signing comes in, it’s often suggested that they need bedding in time yet surely young players need the same if not for any other reason than the jump up.
Afternoon Gooners, I have to respectfully disagree with banning Argentina, what we need is for those in charge to ensure that they always have the most no-nonsense referees in charge of their games and not the succession of weak officials we’ve seen in this World Cup.
You know a couple of early yellow cards would I believe send a message and force a change of culture.
Argentinian players do what they do because they sense the weakness of the referee and the weakness of those behind the officials.
Morning Rico and all, very interesting write up Rico,
It’s got to be a hard job picking and guiding our younger players, as you and other on this site are aware I often disagree about how good some of our younger players, and it’s not that I don’t like them, but sometimes it’s easy to look good in a team that is playing well, for example I like Max Dowman but I don’t feel he is ready to start a match just yet, but saying that I don’t watch many matches from Europe but from what I have seen the premier league seems more physical were the European matches seem to be more open / flow type of game.